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  • Its happening!

    A month ago,the consensus here was that CART was cutting its own throats by going 3.5.The majority pointed to the fact that CART had NO manufacturers commited to the formula,and NO chassis builders committed.

    I was of the opinion that CART would find the chassis and engines it needed but sponsorship was the key.At the time I thought that the IRL needed to get tough with CART but my ideas were largely dissed.

    Well,CARTs derivitive spec.s are out,and lo and behold,they have 3 committed engine suppliers,and appear to have at least 3 chassis builders.Whats more,all of these are current IRL suppliers.

    I said a month ago,that by CART adopting these reg.s,they could save themselves from oblivion AND still have an element of control over the 500.I see this happening now.What I said back then,I reiterate today:

    CART is dead without the 500.Pook knows this and is moving towards commonality.But this latest move is NOT about appeasing TG,its more about having an influence in the future.It is still designed to marginalize the IRL.My idea then,even more relevant today is,make sponsors choose.I know that TG has done well taking the high road but business is business.CART is a competitor.TG has got to leverage the 500 AGAINST CART.At the moment,Indy 500 participation is propping up CART.

    So,I say,time to get aggresive.Do everything posssible to make CART participation in the 500 more difficult but do everything possible to make participating in the IRL easier.
    Start with minimum participation rules for racing teams that compete in other series[read CART].Say that they must compete in at least 8 IRL races a year to qualify.Make sure that there are SEVERAL conflicting dates.Force teams and sponsors to CHOOSE!CART would be gone in a heartbeat if they only had 10 cars show up for some races.

    Even F1 has these rules.To compete,you must race in EVERY round of the championship.This makes sense.The rules should not be tailored to accomodate your business competitor.

    This is all about business.It made good business sense for CART to go the way they are going.Its like K-mart adopting Walmart business stratagies to help them survive.It doesn't mean that Walmart has to sit back and take it.They would agressively position themselves to enhance their brand and degrade their competitors.This is what TG has to do.If the sponsors see that the 500 is not part of the CART package,they would see no reason for an expensive program in a poorly known series with very little exposure.

    I know that a lot here do not agree with me on this but I think that its wrong that IRL races and suppliers will keep CART alive.
    I'm all for a more agressive fight.And,don't be fooled,this is still a fight.Pook isn't capitulating.He's positioning.
    ...the spice must flow.....

  • #2
    The Indianapolis 500 has ALWAYS been about taking on all comers. In order to be fair, your rule would also restrict car owners from having extra cars for the 500, and disallow "true" (non CART) one offers.

    I say no.
    "It's an honor to wear the IRL patch,'' Two-time Indy 500 champion Helio Castroneves.


    • #3
      Not at all.Only full-time race teams[CART]would have to meet eligability requirements.One offs would be accepted.

      If teams want to get tricky with the definition of'team'IMS can make the judgement.
      ...the spice must flow.....


      • #4
        The fear and loathing return. Why? Aren't the IRL regular teams capable of holding their own against the regular CART teams?
        Peter Olivola ([email protected])
        "Too dumb for opera
        too smart for NASCAR"


        • #5
          Not a good idea.
          Have a very blessed day!


          • #6
            Originally posted by Peter Olivola:
            <STRONG>The fear and loathing return. Why? Aren't the IRL regular teams capable of holding their own against the regular CART teams?</STRONG>
            Yes, welcome back P.O.!
            Have a very blessed day!


            • #7
              Agree 100% Rich. I have yet to hear anything from Chris Pook that is different from the usual rhetoric and adopting the IRL's specs is the only way they can survive.


              • #8
                Peter,its not fear of the CART regulars.Its the simple fact that I would like to see CART go away.[far away]

                I make no apologies for wishing for its demise.
                ...the spice must flow.....


                • #9
                  I partially agree Kimball. I don't want a 25/8, but why can't CART stand on its own two feet. It would of not been imaginable 5 or 6 years ago to see that the IRL would be dictating CART's technical requirements but I my opinion, that's what is happening. Evidently CART feels the only they can survive is imitate the IRL in many ways (i.e. engine formula, chassis, cost control etc). It make TG and the other heads of the IRL look like geniuses compared to the incompetent bafoons that have ran CART. The IRL should not allow CART teams to simply waltz in and out as they please. Restricting tires and testing may be a step in this direction. Tires and testing at CART tracks w/ IRL (or IRL like specs) count toward testing. If exceeded, the driver and team are inelgible for any IRL race including the Indy 500.


                  • #10
                    I think it is great that Cart is coming the way of the IRL, for us that have ben around for alot of years and miss alot of the team owners that are in cart and have been misled, and I for one ,am looking forward to some of those drivers racing with us, for the sake of open wheel, lets put our best stuff out there for the world to see., competition is good, open wheel has lost a lot because of the split the last six years, bring them on, may the best win ,we need to be united again, maybe still two series but a common thread.


                    • #11
                      Accept all comers - no 28/5. CART can come to Indy, but a whole month wiped out of their schedule is quite a price to pay.


                      • #12
                        The simple answer was that the second the US 500 started, everybody in it (driver, owner, manufacturer, sponsor, cornor worker, everybody) should have been irevolkably banned for life.

                        Since that was not done, the IRL should have the following rules:

                        - a major points fund based on season standings.

                        - a major apperance money fund based on running every race.

                        - a total ban on advertizing any manufacturer not involved in the actual car being run in the 500 (ie, no Toyota hats when you are driving an Olds, last year).

                        - strict enforcement of tobacco rules (ie, if it says Marlboro in CART, it ain't saying Marlboro at Indy, period.)

                        - a ban on running ANY form of racing from the first day of qualifying through the end of the 500, period. Exception for NASCAR qualifying, if needed, for TS.

                        - a total ban on using the results of the IRL Indianapolis 500 in any other series' standings or schedule (ie, if CART lists the 500 on some future schedule or awards points for it, its a copyright violation and a violation of the entry blank rules, resulting in a disqualification)

                        - a "carved in stone" unquestionable, enforced by a ban for life, adherance to the founding principle of the IRL: equal access to technology. Not one piece of anything that cannot be bought by any with the cash will be allowed on Speedway property, ever, period.

                        - a $1.1M entry fee, with a cooresponding $1M credit against said fee for any team that entered every IRL race in the previous year, or promises to do so in the current year.

                        - a total ban on logos from other series on Speedway property.

                        - a requirement that all drivers, owners, and crew members wear the official IRL patch, 3 x 3, on the top left hand side (ie, same rule as NASCAR with the Winston patch).


                        • #13
                          Listen Kimble , stop crying about Cart on this board. We all know you dislike Cart, so stop bitchin about it...


                          • #14
                            Now is not the time for vindictiveness or to settle personal scores, inserting such components into a logical well thought and so far successful business model (IRL) would doom it to failure. No welfare for CART or IRL teams the 33 fastest race period.
                            Corn fed hoosier forever,
                            University of Kansas Cancer Center


                            • #15
                              Elio,give me a break.This is an IRL topic,on an IRL board.

                              As I said,I don't like CART,and apologies for such are not forthcoming.If you do not like what I say,let's see a rebuttal,not a whiney blurb.If you are really perturbed by what you read,stay off this forum.
                              ...the spice must flow.....


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