Question for the sages

[Chez Bubba]

Let's say we're on lap 199/200 and under yellow. On the back straight the leader's car runs out of gas and may or may not make it to the line coasting. Is, or at what point is, anyone allowed to pass him?

[jetdoc]

When he slows from the pace of the Pace Car.

[jmart]

Any contenders would have gotten passed him well before the yellow is displayed. Once the pace car picks up the leader, all other cars are supposed to maintain that pace. I can't imagine a scenario where everyone wouldn't get by the car running out gas or slowing before the pace car comes out or the race ends.

jmart

[Chez Bubba]

Jmart, sorry I wasn't more clear. The scenario I had in my head was that the field had already been collected by the pace car, say since lap 195.

Thanks jetdoc!

[jmart]

Chez Buuba,

You were clear enough, I just didn't read your question. What jetdoc said.

jmart

[stymie]

Similar but did happen, Mark Martin, in a Busch Series race pulled off the track with one lap to go and did not win

If the leader breaks/stalls then he is out.

[midtown]

The car must be under power, I believe. Simply coasting across may not cut it for the victory.

[Chez Bubba]

In the old days, weren't they allowed to jump out & push it across the line?

[midtown]

I think Ralph DePalma tried that in a Mercedes around 1913. That's probably where the rule comes from.

[JoeBob]

Originally posted by midtown:
<STRONG>The car must be under power, I believe. Simply coasting across may not cut it for the victory.</STRONG>

You don't have to the engine running, you just have to be using your own power. Coasting across the line counts, as long as it was the car's power that built up the momentum to allow it to cross.

Examples of crossing the line "not under your own power" would be"
- being pushed by your pit crew
- being pushed by another car
- being towed by a safety truck
- being pushed by the driver

[ovalfan01]

Originally posted by Chez Bubba:
<STRONG>In the old days, weren't they allowed to jump out & push it across the line?</STRONG>

Isn't that what Helio wanted to do at Texas II?

[dalz]

You guys sure a driver can't push it himself, as long as it's just him alone? Historically, it's been tried, tho not for a win anywhere. How about back to the pits?

How's this for a scenario: On the last lap of the 500 coming out of four, Helio blocks an outside pass attempt by Cheever and knocks them both into the wall. HCN's car stops just short of pit lane, but the Red Bull car slides to just short of the finish line. (nobody else is within a lap or two). While the pace car gathers up everyone, sweaty Uncle Eddie climbs out, yanks off some spark plug wires, a front wing, and the TRANSPONDER and runs across the line. He raises his hands in triumph, claiming that parts of his bodywork, engine, and a tire (from the crash) crossed the line first. Did he win?

[vegasduo]

IIRC, Stirling Moss at the Daytona 24 hours suffered engine failure in the closing minutes of the race. He coasted to the high side of the banking just short of the S/F line. He waited until time was up then engaged the starter and coasted down the banking to cross the S/F line well ahead of the second place car. Can't remember what kind of car he was driving or what was the exact year.

[Jakester]

Boils down to you CAN'T gain places under the yellow, but you CAN lose places.

[Lucky161]

I thought it was Dan Gurney that waited on the last lap deal, but I could be wrong. I think most of the time pushing even by the driver has not been allowed, but I am sure there have been some examples where it was.