25 starters

[Lucky161]

plus Herb who didn't start.
Now if the following drivers that should have rides were added, someone would have to go home.
1. Greg Ray. It's sad that a former champion and multiple winner doesn't have a ride. I know it's spending someone else's money, but if I have my car or cars safely in the field and a back up car, Greg gets the back up.
2. Sarah Fisher. The most popular driver. Same as above, after Greg.
3. Mark Dismore. Previous winner. Needs to be in the race.
4. Dare. Not my favorite, but he showed yesterday that he also deserves to be there.
5. John Paul Jr. Another previous winner and I am just not convinced that he is washed up.
6. Robby Unser. The name helps a lot and he did ok when he was running.
7. Johnny Unser. See above.
8. Rice. I don't know much about him, but all reports are that he is ready.
26+8. 34 cars. Sounds ok to me.
Again, I realize this is spending someone else's money, but if you have the back up available, buy some insurance and what are the extra cost? I realize that not every team would be able to even consider this, but Panther, Kelley, Hemelgarn, Foyt, Penske, Ganassi, Menard, D&R and Cheever should all be able to handle this. That's nine teams and eight drivers.

[Tumbleman]

Sorry, but what about the extra team members, entry fee, the second set of pit equipment, the second set of tires, fuel, etc. required to run and pit a second car during the race?

I do agree that it is a shame these drivers are not out there (Dare being the exception) but the only way to guarantee yourself a ride is to bring your own sponsor. Someone got rich off of Sarah's merchandising, and clearly it isn't Sarah!

[indyracefan]

Originally posted by Tumbleman:
<STRONG>

I do agree that it is a shame these drivers are not out there (Dare being the exception) but the only way to guarantee yourself a ride is to bring your own sponsor. Someone got rich off of Sarah's merchandising, and clearly it isn't Sarah!</STRONG>

....what?!? What's wrong with Dare?,...especially when compared with Fisher??

No offense to all in involved and I know this goes against the
supposed IRL mantra but I'd put Dare in a car before Fisher.

[tedt]

Here's my take on these drivers, for what little it's worth.

1. GR isn't one of my favorites. I tend not to care much for rich, smug, apple-pie, Jeff Gordon, God-thankin' pretty-boy types from Plano places, but he does add a certain flavor to the scene. I really hope he does end up at Bradley. I think it would be mutually beneficial. I could actually root for him a little there in the underdog role.

2. Sarah could really use a year with lots o' laps in IPS and everything else with 4 open wheels. She needs to regain her confidence. She's an asset to the league and needs some TLC.

3. I love Diz. I want him back. He was snakebit in that Kelly equipment.

4. Dare should be back, too. He's a nice kid with talent and spunk. A good compliment-adversary to Sammy. Wholesome suave outspoken Latino vs. wholesome shy fumbling Midwest boy.

5. John Paul, Jr. was always one of my favorites, always fighting back, usually with subpar equipment. One of those little highlights from the Race was when he was running strong up front in the Pelphrey car well into the Race, in maybe 98. But he hasn't shown anything lately. Is he interested? How strong is his desire?

6. Robby Unser is a krazy b*stard junior Eddie Cheever (my favorite driver.) He got game and needs to be racing in the IRL. Where is he?

7. Nix Johnny Unser. Has never, ever been up front.

8. Rice may need to showcase himself in IPS for a year.

[ March 03, 2002: Message edited by: tedt ]

[Roni]

Toss up. Dare crashes way to much and Sarah has tore up a few cars herself. Neither has won a race although Sarah I believe has a higher finish then Dare', Sarah's second to Dare's third. Both are young, good looking, and good for our league. So with that said, when I hit the powerball and form my racing team I will put both of them in a car. It is to close to call.

[Tumbleman]

Indyracefan, you misunderstood what I meant... (I was unclear)

what I meant was, Dare doen't count in my statement because, in fact, he was out there on Saturday.

By no means did I intend to knock Dare or his skills.
- B

[Lucky161]

The reason I put Dare in this list was because he is not the official driver in that car and even though he had a pretty good run, he probably isn't being considered for the permanent driver since Beechler's injuries are not severe. But perhaps I should have said that up front.

That said it looks like we have a mostly agreement on who should be in the next open seats, more or less. I would like to see some more comments there, since we have a small sample at this time.

But that leaves the questions about the other expenses. I covered the catostropic loss with insurance originally, but I didn't mention the others and I realize they are real, but I don't think they are that hard to provide.
First, let's look at the extra crew. I say you don't need an extra crew or at least not a full extra crew. Unless the sub qualifies up front and the regular takes a provisional, the regular automatically gets to pit first and the sub second. If it is usually a two car team, then half of each team could combine for the third crew, leaving those that need to do other things could still do them. Also, this is a good place to use volunteer or extra help in a training mission. So I don't see much if any extra cost here.
Pit equipment. Could be rented from another team that did not make the field but had the equipement available, reducing their cost for a less than successful weekend.
Tires and fuel could be offset by either local pickup sponsorship/additional sponsorship from one of the other cars and/or prize money. The additional funding would probably have to be agreed to ahead of time. But an example would be that Penske makes a side deal with one of his associate sponsors to provide X dollars for primary sponsorship of an extra car if he fields it. Of course at a bargain rate since the additional expenses would not be that high.
I don't propose that this is a perfect solution, only an idea that addresses some problems at a cost that is affordable for some teams. Now the chances of this second or third car actually winning would be slim, but given the right set of circumstances I believe any of those drivers could snag a win and all could make a good showing.

[Jim Cluny]

Dare top of list and further down in choice perhaps John P or Robbie U. The rest are pretty much where they belong. Out of danger and not position to be a danger to anyone else.

There are drivers outside the current IRL sphere who would be quite viable additions.

Ray has been at it too long to ever get the hang of responsible driving. Fisher after a year or so in a ladder series will continue her schooling and get a job. The others will hang around wondering up and down pit road until they grow old.

Bring us some more Sams, Penskes and Scheckters.

[indyracefan]

Originally posted by Tumbleman:
<STRONG>Indyracefan, you misunderstood what I meant... (I was unclear)

what I meant was, Dare doen't count in my statement because, in fact, he was out there on Saturday.

By no means did I intend to knock Dare or his skills.
- B</STRONG>

.........oh, well then, nevermind!!

[jandj]

Last year AJ was catching h#!! for not running two cars , now we want him to run 3 ?

Wouldn't surprise me to see a third Foyt car at Indy , but a two car team is enough , if you want either to do well .

[dgr]

"Dare crashes way to much"

Hmmm...It doesn't seem to me he crashes way too much so I did some research.

Dare has crashed 4 times in 23 IRL starts. That is 17%.(and 2 of his accidents were not his fault). Ray has crashed 13 times in 43 starts (30%) and Dismore has crashed 11 times in 52 starts (21%).

When you factor out the mechanical DNFs, Dare has finished in the top 10 10 times out of 12 running finishes (83%). Ray has 12 top 10s out of 18 finishes (67%). Dismore has 16 top 10s out of 30 finishes (53%).

Airton rarely qualifies well so he does not get as much attention, but once the race starts if he has any kind of a good car - he goes to the front! And he is one of the best in the IRL on restarts.

It would be interesting to see what he would do with a full ride on a well funded team.

[zoom_zoom]

Originally posted by indyracefan:
<STRONG>


....what?!? What's wrong with Dare?,...especially when compared with Fisher??

No offense to all in involved and I know this goes against the
supposed IRL mantra but I'd put Dare in a car before Fisher.</STRONG>

Lets keep her out of a car all together popular or not she is dangerous to all the other drivers.

[jetdoc]

You know, I've read many a post on here that bashes Airton Dare. I didn't understand it until I started looking back at many of the posts. Several people in here think that he lost his job (as has been posted more than once) when Galles folded. I was scratching my head wondering when he drove for Galles. Then it hit me! Several people in here have him confused with Didier Andre that was AUJ's teammate last year at Galles. Didier Andre doesn't deserve to drive on the freeway let alone in an IRL car. But Airton Dare's got so much upside to him that it's incredible! Airton drove for Team X-treme last year in the 1-800-BAR-NONE car if I'm not mistaken and he was a runner. As dgr said, he doesn't crash that often (unlike Andre) and he's right that he usually doesn't qualify all that well, but once that "Green Flag" drops, he's on the move. He's a very patient and intelligent driver and does deserve a ride in the IRL. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but you give that kid some "decent" equipment (not Team X-treme) and he'll make it work for you.

[sabin_24]

Originally posted by jetdoc:
<STRONG>You know, I've read many a post on here that bashes Airton Dare. I didn't understand it until I started looking back at many of the posts. Several people in here think that he lost his job (as has been posted more than once) when Galles folded. I was scratching my head wondering when he drove for Galles. Then it hit me! Several people in here have him confused with Didier Andre that was AUJ's teammate last year at Galles. Didier Andre doesn't deserve to drive on the freeway let alone in an IRL car. But Airton Dare's got so much upside to him that it's incredible! Airton drove for Team X-treme last year in the 1-800-BAR-NONE car if I'm not mistaken and he was a runner. As dgr said, he doesn't crash that often (unlike Andre) and he's right that he usually doesn't qualify all that well, but once that "Green Flag" drops, he's on the move. He's a very patient and intelligent driver and does deserve a ride in the IRL. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but you give that kid some "decent" equipment (not Team X-treme) and he'll make it work for you. </STRONG>

I agree, jet. Dare is an incredible talent. He did pretty well in the Team X-treme car last year, and with good equipment, like Panther Racing, he would win races. I like the guy, and he needs a ride in the IRL.