Indy 500 Bibliography

[JThur1]

While the writer brings up many great points about Cobb, and more importantly Stump's errors and behavior, I would have preferred it being somewhere other than Bleacher Report, which itself has had some issues with facts. It makes me wonder why this article didn't wind up somewhere else. There's also the writer avoiding mention of Cobb's assault on the black groundskeeper and the passage: "I use to live four blocks away from there and I could see Cobb’s mausoleum from my upstairs bedroom window." Which I only mention as possible concern over localism creeping in. I'm reminded of one person's crusade to clear Cap Anson's name from being the person that stood in the way of baseball intergration because they are a Chicagoan and don't want their hometown hero tainted. Trying to portray Anson as not being as much of a racist by pointing out the behavior of other peers doesn't exactly make a strong case for Anson.

Cobb clearly deserved - and still deserves - reappraisal, but Leerhsen's approach seems to involve gross revisionism. The pendulum doesn't have to swing from one extreme to another. In this case, it also appears he noticed others work and swept in (did he credit or cite the BR author?). The Bleacher Report article is from 2011, Leerhsen's book, 2015. Hmm.

[1987Carzan]

Fair enough, it's been widely acknowledged for awhile now that Stump's book was mostly garbage, but I don't feel that one bad book should beget another. It's true that Cobb wasn't the monster that Stump portrayed him to be, but Leerhsen's or anyone else's attempts to gloss over his real transgressions is not something I'm interested in.

This thread has inspired me to re-read Paul Page's book, so that's good.

EDIT- I should mention that Stump's book, along with American Psycho, are the only books that I've actually thrown away rather than sell or donate.

[Eric Paddon]

I'd like an Ed Elisian book, he's a much more sympathetic figure than Ty Cobb could ever be. One of my main(many) problems with A Terrible Beauty was trying to understand who that book was actually for. Like, who was clamoring for a revisionist look at Ty freakin' Cobb in 2015? .

Mostly those who suddenly found evidence that Al Stump had been a liar and a fraud in his book about Cobb. Stump forged diaries and letters and then signed Cobb's name to them to create a fake documentary record of many alleged transgressions of Cobb's. Not that Cobb was a saint but some revisionism was badly needed when it came to him to undo the perversions Stump created.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/770355-ty-cobb-hall-of-famer-betrayed-by-writers-for-50-years-ruined-players-legacy

[aracefan]

Don holds "writers" and "reporters" in even greater contempt than John Q. Public, so no Chicago Manual of Style for him, but otherwise, this is a great point and one I've tried to make, repeatedly.

First, Don, I am greatly sorry to hear of your health situation. As one who has recently dealt with something in that neighborhood, I can truly relate and empathize.

While I share your consternation about what should be included in - or actually constitutes - a bibliography, simple encouragement and assistance would go a lot further in getting people interested, and involved in, researching and participating in motorsports history. Yes, the great unwashed, the hoi polloi, like my own background. Nurturing these folks who have the basic interest can go a long ways. Instead, they are berated, needlessly. These folks you rail against are not the enemies of what you are doing or your approach. Instead, they are pushed away, and the well is poisoned. Which accomplishes what, exactly?

I'm reminded of jazz musician Herbie Mann, who was attacked by jazz elitists and snobs for his more mainstream "pop" efforts, despite also doing "serious" jazz concurrently. He was labelled a sellout, and worse. Mann's reply: "I thought we were supposed to make people like the music (jazz) and bring them to it instead of pushing them away from it."

Well put. What's the saying in front of many a house of worship? "All are welcome."

[rjohnson]

I confess, I have not read Monzanapolis yet, but your comments prompted me to check out the book. I was surprised to see that it is much more than simply about about the Monza races. Much of the book is devoted to earlier races in which Europeans came to America to compete in races, and races in which American drivers went to Europe. It will definitely be added to my list, and I really appreciate you mentioning it. Now I have to find time to read it!

[helioseism]

helioseism, thanks for the additions...and the embarrassing correction that I need to make. I chose not to include Monzanapolis as well as books on Langhorne and other tracks because they didn't directly relate to the 500. However, if you have a different point of view about that, I'd welcome your thoughts. Thanks again.

No problem it's up to you what to include. For me, Monza is more relevant than Langhorne since it was an attempt to recreate the Indy 500. But you decide.

[rjohnson]

Thanks for the kind words. I appreciate the suggestions I’ve received.

[aracefan]

Doctorindy - Thanks for mentioning the Hungness 1969-1972 yearbook. I have added it. I have also added several additional titles, plus date of publication and publisher. As always, if you (or anyone) spots errors, has additions to mention, or suggestions on how to improve this list, I would appreciate hearing about those.

Attached is the latest version: [ATTACH]n6951553[/ATTACH]

This is very comprehensive. Keep up the good work.

[rjohnson]

helioseism, thanks for the additions...and the embarrassing correction that I need to make. I chose not to include Monzanapolis as well as books on Langhorne and other tracks because they didn't directly relate to the 500. However, if you have a different point of view about that, I'd welcome your thoughts. Thanks again.

[helioseism]

And there are several additional biographies of Jackie (not Jimmy) Stewart and Graham Hill.

[helioseism]

Here are some additions that I did not find in the list.

Monzanapolis - The Monza 500 Miles - The endless America-Europe challenge
Zana, Aldo
Società Editrice Il Cammello
2017 276p

Duesenberg Race Cars And Passenger Cars Photo Archive
Bill, Jon M.
Iconografix
2005 128p

Ilmor Racing Engines - 1984-1999 - The First Fifteen Years
Spreckley, Natasha
Ilmor
1999 286p

Offenhauser Repair Manual
Clough, Gordon J.
Clough
No date or page numbers

[lotuspoweredbyford]

Your last sentence gave me a good chuckle Carzan I think only Charles Leerhsen was clamoring for the chance for revisionism on Ty Cobb. And he managed to convince a publisher. This seems a pattern with him.

Some writers are better at pitching than the content.

As far as Elisian, I tried to at least do an article on him. My last exchange with Robin Miller was about Elisian. Robin told me he'd love to do one of his "Tough Guy" pieces on Elisian, but the problem was he couldn't come up with anyone still around to talk to about him. I told Robin I could relate, as by the time I found a contact for the Elisian family, Ed's sister and another relative who accompanied him to all of his races had both recently been placed in assisted living facilities. Timing I was able to talk to one other person, not a relative, who had nothing but good things to say about Ed Elisian, and provided a portrait quite different that what's been written about him.

I have something with Elisian you might be interested in, in my most recent purchase of vintage audio there is an interview with Elisian. Definitely worth a listen.

[JThur1]

He literally ignored and dismissed everything Donald told him.

There's more to it than that but I don't want to say anything more about it. The book is utter rubbish.

I didn't get far into perusing it to reach the same conclusion.

As far as the more to it than that, aww, c'mon, go ahead

[JThur1]

I'd like an Ed Elisian book, he's a much more sympathetic figure than Ty Cobb could ever be. One of my main(many) problems with A Terrible Beauty was trying to understand who that book was actually for. Like, who was clamoring for a revisionist look at Ty freakin' Cobb in 2015? "Well when he beat up that black groundskeeper and choked his wife, he wasn't being racist, he was just angry!" Sure guy, let's canonize him then.

It's hard to go wrong trusting the word of DD.

Your last sentence gave me a good chuckle Carzan I think only Charles Leerhsen was clamoring for the chance for revisionism on Ty Cobb. And he managed to convince a publisher. This seems a pattern with him.

Some writers are better at pitching than the content.

As far as Elisian, I tried to at least do an article on him. My last exchange with Robin Miller was about Elisian. Robin told me he'd love to do one of his "Tough Guy" pieces on Elisian, but the problem was he couldn't come up with anyone still around to talk to about him. I told Robin I could relate, as by the time I found a contact for the Elisian family, Ed's sister and another relative who accompanied him to all of his races had both recently been placed in assisted living facilities. Timing I was able to talk to one other person, not a relative, who had nothing but good things to say about Ed Elisian, and provided a portrait quite different than what's been written about him.

[rjohnson]

Doctorindy - Thanks for bringing the Tremayne book to my attention. I've added it to the list. I am reluctant to add magazines and periodicals to the list. It would be an impossible task (for me) to attempt to add all of the articles pertaining to the Indianapolis 500 that have appeared in magazines and periodicals over the years, so I am going to refrain from attempting that. The one exception is that I would consider adding specific issues of magazines and periodicals if that entire issue pertained to the Indianapolis 500.

Indyote - Thanks for mentioning Turbine Grand Prix. I have added it to the list.

Jamski - Thanks!